Randall Balmer reminds Franklin Graham of what he claims to believe. That whole "Obama was born Muslim and has the seed of Islam" was racist bullshit from someone who claims to be a "man of God." He should be ashamed, but fundamentalists know no shame.
15 comments:
Franklin Graham did not say Obama is a Muslim. He said the Muslims consider Obama to be a Muslim because of his father. Graham said that Obama claims to be a Christian and that he(Graham) will have to take his word for it.
But the evidence suggests that Obama is a Muslim. Obama does not understand what it means to be a Christian. Neither do those who contend that he is a Christian. He has said on several occasions that he does not believe what the Bible says. He displays no devotion to Jesus Christ. He is a proud supporter of abortion and homosexuality. No real Christian is.
When Obama makes any reference to Islam, it is always complementary, never critical. Obama obviously has very warm feelings about Islam. He says it is a religion of peace. No real Christian would say that either.
Frank, you are a moron and a bigot. Sorry, but that is the fact. Graham suggested that Obama was born a Muslim because of his father. He knows full well that idiots like you want to think of a black president as the "other" rather than a loyal american. He had a chance to be a person, instead he gave people like you justification.
You are a fucking moron. I guess only idiots get to proclaim their Christian beliefs and be taken seriously. When a thoughtful person like Obama does it, people like you question it.
Don't bother coming in here and talking about "real" Christians. If you are one of those, then count many of us out. We would rather be counted with the heathens than with the bigots who claim to speak for Christ.
No Streak, YOU are the moron. And in addition to being stupid, you are also an anti-Christian bigot!
Like Obama, you don't have the faintest clue what it means to be a Christian. You have never been a Christian, and very likely never will be. So, you will get your wish: God will count you with the heathens.
Conversations with fundamentalists remind me of a saying my boss had about adversarial types: you can only wrestle with a pig in the mud for so long before you come to realize that the pig really, really likes the mud. (He didn't say "mud," but you get the idea.)
Good point, leighton. Disagreeing with Frank is proof that I am not a Christian, because all Christians agree with Frank.
No core beliefs. No principled thought. Just nonsense like believing that gay people are good people--that is enough.
Dude...the Fundies just fucking love your blog. I swear you get a new one every time you post something like this. Something about your blog is like a MAGNET for them.
This one was sneaky. The first paragraph? Plain, normal, and even clarifying a statement. The crazy didn't start until the 2nd paragraph.
I was thinking about adding a statement of my own, but I don't think Frank would get it. Or wants to.
Nope. Fuck it. Poke the bear.
Graham, by acknowledging the Islamic tenet that birth into a Muslim household automatically makes you a Muslim, is lending credence to the Islamic God, Allah. He is acknowledging Allah's existence.
But no true Christian would ever acknowledge that another God exists; there is only one, and it is theirs. Add to this that in order for Graham's hypothesis to work, the teachings in the Koran must be valid. Would a true Christian acknowledge the validity of the lessons in the holy book of another religions and another religion's God? Absolutely not. There is just one God: the Christian God.
Graham, then, is no true Christian.
Ah, Smitty, you just make my day! :) Must be that commonality in loving good beer.
As my friend Greg has noted several times, many evangelicals have simply turned into fundamentalists where they alone are right. it is sad.
Graham, by acknowledging the Islamic tenet that birth into a Muslim household automatically makes you a Muslim, is lending credence to the Islamic God, Allah. He is acknowledging Allah's existence.
Smitty is right here, but to continue on his point, Graham is also denying the salvic effect of conversion to Christ.
President Obama as an adult, choose to follow Jesus Christ as his Lord and Savior, he was then duly baptized in the Sacred Name of the Trinity.
That is the EXACT formula for conversion in Rev. Graham's faith tradition. By putting it to question, Graham is putting the orthodox Evangelical understanding of salvation itself in question.
Talk about selling your birthright for a bowl of stew. So again, Rev. Graham is (as Smitty points out) giving credence to Islamic tenets and at the same time denying the salvic effects of conversion to Christ. And all for political gain. :(
But dear Smitty I must disagree with you here and I suspect you may have said it for effect.
Would a true Christian acknowledge the validity of the lessons in the holy book of another religions and another religion's God?
Yes there are many Christians who do in fact see truth and beauty in the works of other Faiths and believe that the Spirit of God talks through them as well.
† Deo adjuvante, non timendum
†With the help of God, there is nothing to fear
Great point, Monk, and one that Balmer tries to make in his column but not as clear as you.
What amazes me about this is that Bush was essentially no different from a young Ted Kennedy in his own youth. He was irresponsible, and drunken and a womanizer and even unpatriotic. But his conversion experience made all of that go away for the fundy.
I don't believe that George Bush is a Christian anymore than I believe Obama is. Or Streak is.
I wonder if Obama's "Christianity" isn't for political purposes only, since I doubt he could have been elected as a Muslim, or an atheist. I don't know the answer to that question. But I do know that, based on his own words and deeds, that there is no way that Obama is a real Christian. Not a chance.
Well, of course, Frank. Because you can look inside Obama and my own heart. That is quite the magic trick.
Or perhaps you are just a fundy who believes that your way is the only way. Perhaps you should find a site where other fundys pat each other on the back and talk about how other people are such awful non Christians. You can mock Muslims and liberals and just have a great old time convincing yourself that God loves you more.
But I think you should leave here. You are starting to bore the crap out of me.
But dear Smitty I must disagree with you here and I suspect you may have said it for effect.
A little for effect, yes. But the fundies absolutely disavow any other point of view. Look at our new buddy Frank's comments; "true" Christians are commanded to do so. So Monk, sadly, apparently you might not pass muster either.
And ya, Frank, you've got nothing new to add here that we can't predict. Enjoy your bake sales and revivals and suspended reality.
Streak,
I don't have to wonder what's in your heart; you're very open about it. Obama too. You don't hide your unbelief. Maybe because you don't know how.
Maybe because you don't know how.
Ah HA. So, the difference is that Frank has learned how to hide his unbelief under the veil of uber-belief? Brilliant tactic!
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